24
Aug
Does Pat Robertson’s hit on Chavez have a basis in scripture?
Reactions to Pat Robertson’s call for the assassination of Venzuela’s president Hugo Chavez have been mostly negative and almost unanimously entertaining. Pentagon and State Department officials, for instance, made haste to “distance” themselves from Robertson’s foreign policy initiative — raising in the process the question of how in hell they got close enough to him to require distancing — and other institutions and individuals weren’t far behind.
Rush Limbaugh was a bit more discreet in his approach, saying he didn’t think the comments were newsworthy and that the mainstream press who wanted his comments on the subject were “just grasping at straws out there at anything they can do to try to discredit all of the right wing or the conservative movement in this country.”
Of course the press aren’t really good at that sort of thing, so we’re fortunate in having Robertson to do it for us.
MSNBC provided analysis of Robertson’s comments, which seemed superfluous until we realized there was an aspect to them that we hadn’t considered: Is it scripturally sound to put out a contract on a head of state? The network caught up with Biblical scholar and media magnate Marvin Olasky in full flight from his coreligionist, and asked for his help.
NORAH O’DONNELL, ANCHOR MSNBC-TV: What do [you] make of what Pat Robertson said?MARVIN OLASKY: Well Pat’s 75, he’s had a live television show for decades, and sometimes he blurts things out. He doesn’t represent Evangelicals, and I hope that people in Venezuela don’t think that he represents the United States.
O’DONNELL: You mean he doesn’t represent Evangelicals in general? Or when he makes this particular comment out assassinating Chavez because it would be cheaper that going to war with him?
OLASKY: Well both. Biblically, assassination may be used in times of war, last time I looked we were not at war with Venezuela. We’re supposed to pray for those in government and those around the world in positions of leadership, not assassinate them.
So he doesn’t represent a Christian view as far as his interpretation of scripture, and I’m not sure he represents how many people he represents in the Evangelical community.
But it’s immediately obvious that Olasky is wrong: We are at war. Everybody says so, and we could hardly have a War President if we weren’t. And now that we know the Bible sanctions hits during wartime, it’s pretty clear Pat has the Good Book at his back on this one and Olasky’s thinly veiled suggestion that Robertson is a senile old freak is just sour grapes. As for whether Robertson represents how many people he represents, how could he not?
Meanwhile, Hullabaloo proprietor Digby recalls that Chavez, and Saddam before him, aren’t alone on Robertson’s hit parade — “Maybe we need a very small nuke thrown off on Foggy Bottom to shake things up” — and wonders how long it will be before some concerned member of Robertson’s flock, which is considerably larger than the embittered Olansky would have us believe, acts on one of his suggestions or seeks out an appropriate target of opportunity, such as Switzerland or the National Weather Service offices.
It may be unfair to label Robertson as a popular deranged extremist or Olasky as a bitter, small-time competitor. We would encourage followers of both men to begin a vigorous public debate on the matter, and to pressure their elected representatives to chime in as well. As our experience in Iraq has demonstrated, it’s better to hash out these ideological/spiritual questions before the theocracy takes hold rather than afterward.
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UPDATE: 7:44 AM HST 8/24/05
Robertson now says his remarks were taken out of context and that he “never said assassination.” Let’s go to the video, shall we?
“If he thinks we’re trying to assassinate him, I think we really ought to go ahead and do it. It’s a whole lot cheaper than starting a war.“We have the ability to take him out, and I think the time has come that we exercise that ability. We don’t need another $200 billion war to get rid of one strong-arm dictator. It’s a whole lot easier to have some of the covert operatives do the job and then get it over with.
Now Robertson says “I didn’t say ‘assassination.’ I said our special forces should ‘take him out.’ And ‘take him out’ can be a number of things, including kidnapping; there are a number of ways to take out a dictator from power besides killing him. I was misinterpreted by the AP but that happens all the time.”
And he’s right. “Take him out” for a really long dinner. “Take him out” for a ball game. “Take him out” to the woodshed. And so on. We probably are being unreasonable in interpreting “If he thinks we’re trying to assassinate him, I think we really ought to go ahead and do it” as a call for assassination.
I’m sort of disappointed in Pat. If you’re going to say something like that on tape, you should be prepared to stick to your guns, not silence them.
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Biblical direction! According to the bible slavery is ok, guess I’ll go our and buy a few!
August 24th, 2005 at 3:00 amAccording to the bible? Go ahead and show some scripture before you make ignorant comments like that.
August 24th, 2005 at 3:28 amEven if it were in the Bible, it is a ficticious book, with no more authority than “The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn.” So come all ye faithful, or unfaithful with biblical reference, and I’ll respond with counterevidence from Don Quijote.
August 24th, 2005 at 3:47 amHi guys…just dropping by on a random bored moment…i’m guessing it’ll be pretty unlikely that i’ll be back as this is merely a ‘flying visit…’
But while I’m here, might i just encourage Matt Smith to do his research/fact checking/education before he makes such a statement as ‘the Bible is a ficticious book.’ For a start Matt, any old fool knows that the Bible is not just one book but a collection of books! So which in particular is fiction? And on what do u base ur assumption on? What do you know about Critical Biblical Theory, archeology, history, canonical development etc?
Please sir, whether you are ‘unfaithful’ or ‘faithful’, don’t make ur decision on hearsay and unestablished theories.
Personally, i happen to believe that the Bible isn’t fictitous…but that position has been reached on the back of doubt, research, thought and study. It is not blind faith! Indeed, one does not have to commit intellectual suicide to be a follower of Jesus!
So, with all due respect sir…please, don’t just blindly believe everything you’ve heard! Question everything! Test everything! The truth has nothing to fear from honest and balanced investigation.
By the way, seeing as my returning to this site is improbable, feel free to contact me on blackcountryforever@yahoo.co.uk if what i said raised any questions.
PS…what Robertson said made me very sad indeed…
August 24th, 2005 at 4:15 amNowhere in the Bible does Jesus Christ endorse assasination, not even for the people who assasinated HIM. He said, “Forgive them for they know not what they do.” Christians follow the word of Christ therefore Robertson is not a Christian. Claiming that Jesus endorses assasination in times of war is a lie. Here’s what Jesus says: If any one strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. – Jesus
It hath been said, Thou shall love your neighbor, and hate your enemy. But I say to you love your enemies, bless them that curse you. Do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which spite you and persecute you. -Jesus
Whatsoever you would want men to do to you, do so to them: for this is the law. -Jesus
HOW CAN YOU ASSASINATE PEOPLE AND FOLLOW JESUS’ LAWS? YOU CAN’T! HOWEVER JESUS COULDV’E BEEN SPEAKING OF MEN LIKE ROBERTSON WHEN HE SAID:
Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. – Jesus
August 24th, 2005 at 4:22 amwhy do i have a feeling people are just running off with unsubstantiated info?. I thought Pat said “…. if Chaves thinks we want to assasinate him, then we should go ahead!”. Correct me if i am wrong here. And what interpretation is there to this?.
August 24th, 2005 at 4:51 amwhen you have a highly reconizable religious leader (who just happens to be publically backing the executive wing of our government) call on the government for the murder of foreign dignitaries, that’s a big deal, sorry rush.
this type of behaviour is NO different than Ayman al-Zawahri’s insane renewed threats earlier this month.
the only truth that can be extruded from this filth is that extreme religious fundementalism, be it Christian or Muslim, is exactly the same problem.
we can all be sure that Mr Osama Bin Laden tipped his hat to Al-Qaeda’s “No. 3″ after this public demonstration.
Let me be the first to condemn him.
As for the adminstration’s response to these comments:
August 24th, 2005 at 5:15 amwahtever. osama is a civilan too. that doesn’t stop him from being a ntaional threat.
“By thier fruits, ye shall know them.”
August 24th, 2005 at 5:23 amThe Bible condones slavery. For instance, see Ephesians chapter 6:
“Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.
“Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but like slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart.
“Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not men”
I’m glad many American slaves disobeyed the bible and ran away. I would have done the same.
August 24th, 2005 at 5:23 amBack again despite earlier promises!
David, i woulda done the same too!
But beware of taking a verse out of cultural context. This verse doesn’t condone slavery at all. Firstly, it is not a doctrinal manual, but rather a letter to encourage and inform Christians in first century Ephesus. With Paul’s comment in another letter that there is ‘neither slave nor free’ in Christ, we might expect a theological treatise on slavery to be dead against it.
But as it is, it may well be that Paul would have put the lives of Ephesian slaves in serious danger had he advocated running away, not to mention the whole christian community there and elsewhere-with the state’s suspicions against the ’sect’ of Christianity already high, which even slightly intelligent Jesus-follower would speak out against institutions deemed to bre an important part of society!? It would be a disaster!
I think, although i don’t know, that slavery and other exploitative/degrading aspects of Greco-Roman society were spoken out against by Christians…
Nevertheless, this, and other verses in the Bible have been used to justify slavery. How tragic.
August 24th, 2005 at 5:55 ambtw…i meant to reiterate my suggestion that this is not a didactic text but rather a letter…
I really am going now, honestly…camping in Wales calls where there’ll be no chance of Net surfin’ at all!
August 24th, 2005 at 5:58 amIndeed, Jesus was quite popular for all those teachings that support preemptory war, imperial occupation, unregulated capitalism, and bitter partisanship.
It’s all spelled out in the Beatitudes and the Parable of the Good Samaritan. It’s encouraging that Pat Robertson and his followers study their bible so much.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:11 amCarl, sadly manly Biblical passages explicitly condone slavery.
Leviticus 25:44 states “as for your male and female slaves whom you may have: you may buy male and female slaves from among the nations around you.”
Leviticus 19:20 instructs that no man should ever be put to death for having sex with his female slave, because he has the right to do that.
Exodus 21:7 states that it’s okay to sell your daughter as a slave.
and worst of all there’s Exodus 21:20 “when a man strikes his slave, male or female with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished, but if the slave survives a day or two he is not to be punished; for the slave is his money.”
This was the Bible passage Pre-Civil war slave owners followed when whipping their African slaves to death.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:26 amThank God Pat didn’t win the race to be president of USA. He would have made Hittler look like a saint! Georgie boy with all his killing and raping would also look holy.
AMERICANS OPEN YOUR EYES AND SEE WHAT YOUR LEADERS ARE MADE OFF, PAT ROBERTSON IS NOT DIFFERENT THAN OSAM BIN LADEN
August 24th, 2005 at 10:47 amRE: update. Sheer, astounding, jaw-dropping stupidity! The man runs a network and broadcasts a daily show, but doesn’t know about or understand the capabilities of videotape?
August 24th, 2005 at 5:00 pm